I recently met up with a friend for a couple drinks at a local bar. Part of our conversation went something like this:
Me: Good to see you again man, you haven't been out in forever.
Friend: I know, my girlfriend is away for the next couple weeks, and I was getting bored of being home alone.
Me: Oh yeah, how are things going with her?
Friend: It's good man, I just don't know... it's been a year and I'm starting to get kinda itchy.
Me: Yikes, you should probably go get that checked out.
Friend: HA! No, no, not itchy as in herpes, itchy as in restless. My eyes keep wandering. I keep wondering if I should end it and look for someone else.
Me: Oh OK, gotcha... but wait, really? From what Greg [his roommate, a mutual friend of ours] tells me, she treats you like a king.
Friend: Dude, no, it's true - she is awesome. She does everything I can possibly want. She never says no to sex, she cleans my apartment, she cooks food for me, she is fun to be around - everything.
Me: Sounds like a keeper. So what's the problem?
Friend: I want to fuck other girls.
Me: Ha! of course you do, you are a man; you're always going to feel like that.
Friend: Arghh, man, I KNOW. But it is really bothering me. I mean, she does everything I want. She wakes up before me in the morning to cook me breakfast, she cleans my room for me - she even cleans Greg's room sometimes. I tell her to give me a blowjob, she gives me an amazing blowjob. I tell her I am going to put it in her butt, she just asks me to use extra lube. She picked me up from the airport recently wearing a thong and an overcoat, then we fucked the second we walked in the house.
Me: Damn, that is awesome... I've never really had a girl like that.
Friend: I know man, but even with all of that, I still want to fuck other girls. Like, I would even fuck a girl less hot than her, just for the variety.
Me: Yeah... I know exactly what you mean, sometimes you just want something new. Even a smoking hot girl gets old after... well, not even after very long, you know?
Friend: Yeah man, seriously! You always have those illusions of 'the perfect girl' - the one who you'd always be happy with and attracted to, but the fact is that the illusions wouldn't last; eventually you'd get used to her too.
Me: It's that animal instinct, man. When the hunt is over the thought of a new body starts to creep into the back of your mind - a new body with new curves, new hair and new lips... we are wired to feel that way. If men didn't want to fuck as much as we do, humans wouldn't have evolved anywhere near as quickly as we have. It's just our genetics trying to propagate the species.
Friend: Exactly. Gotta spread that seed! Hahaha, I'm just thinking about doing what mother nature wants me to do. All natural, baby.
Me: Hahah yeah but I mean, the thing is, cheating on your girl isn't going to fix the problem, it is just going to postpone it. You'd get a new girl and start to feel the same restlessness with her too.
Friend: Yeah man. I guess you are right, it just kinda sucks.
Me: Well, yeah it sucks, and at this point in my life I avoid that problem mostly by avoiding relationships in general. But I like to think that there is a girl out there that I'll like enough that I will be willing to suppress those instincts for - at least enough to get over that initial difficulty. I haven't found her yet, but it's conceivable someone like that exists. I think you just need to decide if your girl now is "that girl" for you.
Friend: Yeah maybe that's true. We'll see what happens.
__________________________
I am sure some women would try to attribute my friends' restlessness to his girlfriend being too easy or boring - and there might even be some truth to either or both of those suggestions. However, the fact remains that men will always want to have sex with multiple women. Most men successfully hide this from their wives or girlfriends (out of respect for them), and a good number of men will never act on those impulses, either because they don't know how to, are afraid of what will happen if they do, or because they realize that their sexual impulses are never going to go away, so they learn to live with and control them. But all of us feel that drive.
Have you considered that his gf has picked up on this and is getting a little desperate? Cleaning his room is fine, but cleaning for whoever Greg is - that's not a great gf, that's a maid.
ReplyDeleteI'd like to point out that this situation is slightly similar for both parties. Of course women don't have the same urge to see new men naked, but when the magic disappears, it disappears for both. Women want a lot of validation, and he definitely doesn't look at her now the way he did when they met.
I'm sure you know this, I'm just pointing out that the longing for other men/women are the same for both sexes, although they have different reasons.
Perhaps some men miss sexual variety more than others, but those who are really suffering ought to be in an open relationship/marriage. I don't know how your friend would feel about it, or if it's a big problem considering your gf could sleep with other men. Maybe for some time it's preferable, just to see what the alternative really feels like.
I just came across this post and whomever thinks that women "don't have the same urge to see new men naked" is sadly misinformed! Women like variety in partners/lovers, too. It's time you men grasp that notion!!!!!!
DeleteYou can say that again Anonymous! Men just choose to believe we don't.
Deletehttp://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testosterone
DeleteCheck out Act Two.
Some of us men would love to have our female partner/spouse WANT to have sex with people outside the relationship. Not all of us are narcissistic chauvinists. I would even bet that "most" men in some form of monogamous relationship would be ecstatic if their SO expressed interest in some form of non-monogamous activity.
DeletePoint is, ladies speak up and tell your man that you want, think about, or outright are horny for sexual variety and are willing to do so WITH your partner.
I agree with anonymous 1:27pm. This story seems a little fishy. CLEANING GREG'S ROOM? Nah! that's not right. Even if Greg is his brother or something. A woman can always tell when other things (women) are on his mind...I think it's evident that this is the case here and she is putting in extra work that she really should not. Girlfriend is not maid, or mother.....or sex slave!
ReplyDeleteThing is, Anonymous, that it's not just "when the magic dies". I'm about a year into a relationship with a wonderful woman who I love, and she loves me to an absurd degree. However, I am alo feeling the itch - both fantasing about and logically wondering about leaving and 'playing the field'. And I know that's really stupid as I have it so good, and she's been nothing but a fantastic partner and will continue to be so. But the itch is still there.
ReplyDeletePoint is, though, that for her the magic is abosultely still there. She's in love with me like a teenager, and I'm thinking these thoughts. If she knew it would break her heart
Yes Anonymous it would break her heart momentarily but she would move on just fine, really. Females don't fall in love like men do, our emotions are far more fickle. It happens more often to us in a lifetime and goes deeper quicker, ends quicker and we recover quicker and move on to experience the same with another man quicker. It's just how we are wired.
DeleteCouldn't agree more. Men never want the homie to find out lol..
DeleteI'm also dating an absolutely fantastic woman who I love dearly. I was playing the field when I met her, but fell for her hard and agreed to give up the variety to be able to be with her. I traded something I valued for something I valued more. It was still something I valued a lot though. It is so engrained in male biology. Women don't understand what a man is giving up...if a top 20% guy with options agrees to monogamy, he REALLY likes you. Women project their motivations onto men, and they assume a man's sleeping around is about looking to replace here, when it's usually just scratching an itch.
DeleteI'm really missing something though and it makes me feel depressed, consequently being harmful to my relationship with her. It's a real bind, and the really bad part is it's absolutely unnecessary. It's just cultural inertia. I'm beginning to think Swingers have it figured out as they can induldge their taste for variety while keeping an eye on their partner and sharing the afterglow with them, all with another couple who are taking exactly the same risks.
Anonymous, I just stumbled on this post and almost instantly felt this was my partner. We are now 5 years into our relationship and I still adore him and am in love with him like a teenager as you describe. Even with these strong feelings for him, I too have the itch to experience other men as he is the only man I've had sex with or maintained a long-term relationship with. I, too, have fantasized about leaving and have come close a few times. When an attractive guy asks me out, I can easily get swept away in what it'd be like to be chased again. But I choose my partner every time. I, as a woman, feel isolated and guilty as this idea is perpetuated time and time again that this is simply a "man's issue" and women don't want to experience the variety of different sexual partners. I wish my partner had approached me three years ago about this, so we could have talked and worked through it together. I hope everything worked out for you.
DeleteI guess this goes to show that it's not just men who need to continue game when they're in LTR's. Predictable, perfect partners are boring for men as they are for women.
ReplyDeleteLadies, you need to stay independent (no, that doesn't mean be a sassy smartmouth who never cooks or gives blowjobs). But becoming your man's sex slave and maid like this girl is just going to make him wonder if there are other decently hot girls who would do the same doting nonsense. He'll take it for granted. You can do this to a man who you know deserves it (aka, has married you) because then it's more likely that he'll be the type to not take it for granted.
Of course, there will always be insatiable men out there who want something new no matter what, but thankfully, they are easy for girls to spot early on. Then it's up to how healthy your self-esteem is (like I mentioned before, stay independent, don't get cut off from your friends, stick with your own hobbies, and develop yourself always!).
I don't agree with this at all. If the woman is hot enough and fun, most men aren't seriously going to consider straying. This is particularly true if the man is over 30 because he is more mature and knows just how hard it is to find a hot and loyal woman who isn't completely self-absorbed.
DeleteKurt, I didn't say a man would be seriously tempted to cheat - or even tempted at all. I just said that he is wired to want to have sex with a lot of women, and has to live with that desire (whether or not he chooses to indulge it).
DeleteMale, here.
DeleteReligious, choose to not even touch female skin until i entered a serious relationship at 24. First breast i saw IRL. Got married with another woman at 29.
On my wifes initiative, i quited porn. I'm satisfied with that decision, even though i have a regular urge to consume porn again. God willing, i wont go back to it.
But i still have a very real urge to have sex with other women, despite me only having had vaginal sex with one single woman in my entire life. Due to my life long porn consumption up until i gave it up recently (9 month ago), i really would like to have a threesome.
My wife hates it, and gets hurt. She feels insufficient. I get sad that she gets hurt. I still have the urges. She has accepted that it's a part of me being a man.
I want loads of kids (10), she can't produce them. I want sex with other women, she feels insufficient. I wish to marry more than one wife, even though i agreed to never getting a second wife, when i married.
She agreed to me having sex with a second wife, if i raise my male-value to a very high standard, undefined, up to her discretion. If practical problems can be solved (society accepting, maybe hiding it, economy etc.)
Raising male value, meaning becoming rich, getting a great body, taking her to great trips abroad, gaining more social skills and so on.
My life would be easier if my sexual drive could settle with only having one wife, but then again, humanity would loose on it.
Why would i else be bothered to raise my male value? For her sake? But i have her with my current value.
"You would if you REALLY loved her".
Bah, thats your egoism talking. How about reversing it?
Wow. Bold woman to make the offer, but she probably doesn't realize how much of a fire that would light under most men's asses... Talk about motivation.
Delete@Anonymous 2:42 AM:
ReplyDeleteDon't worry, she probably feels the same way and has already sucked and fucked your best friend. Women are ridiculously good at being head over heels in love with one guy and fooling around with other(s). We are naturally polyamorous.
"We are naturally polyamorous."
DeleteUtter nonsense. We are not animals.
"We are not animals."
Deleteyes we are.
We are animals that have developed beyond most so we have a morality as well, an ability to plan ahead, to make complex decisions.
DeleteSo we are animals but with an ability to reason and I guess it depends on upbringing and society to what extent we let our basal animal desires pervade our rationality or 'human-ness'
"We are animals that have developed beyond most"
DeleteAnd yet nearly as high a percentage of women cheat on their husbands (>40%)as men that cheat on their wives (>60%). Since it is usually only one partner that is cheating at any one time in marriages, that means that the % of marriages that have some form of infidelity is even higher.
Our sense of reason can easily counter a loosely held morality, our ability to plan ahead makes cheating more secretive, and our ability to make complex decisions makes it possible to juggle multiple relationships. The real answer is to recognize that monogamy itself is antithesis to human beings. Despite religious dogma to the contrary, humans were never meant to be monogamous and would not be if society did not force it upon us.
Amen to that! Women dream up the prince and her job is to protect the pups so she needs a reliable partner. Most men can be that but they may even feel good about themselves if they cheat because they hide it so well. If my man were cheating on me there is no way i would not know that. Women tell themselves more lies than men tell them. The ones that choose not to tell themselves lies, may cheat. The alternative would be separation. Most men cant bare to lose a woman they love so if a woman makes a decision to leave she has to leave. If she stays she need to work with the man. Ultimatums are demeaning. The idea of owning anything is ludicrous. Stop the lies. Being secretive is not good for anyone involved.
DeleteI don't know if this is news to a lot of the female readers out there, but to me it's not. A lot of my guy friends have admitted this before, and I personally have been in the situation of your friend's girlfriend. However, I'd like to pose a question to the author...what's the point of telling women this? True, it gives women a glimpse into the male mind, and I try to recognize that this is a very really struggle for a lot of guys. But I'll never really be able to empathize with how a guy feels in this arena, and I think most women can't. Information like this kind of just makes me feel frustrated and wonder if men and women will ever be able to have stable relationships. As you can already see, a lot of the female comments are getting really defensive, and I think it stems from how powerless women feel about this dark reality of the male mind.
ReplyDeleteThis post reminds me of the scene from HBO's Girls, when the character Marnie starts spontaneously masturbating after a cocky artist tells her that he's going to f*** her like a real man, despite the fact that she can't get aroused by her devoted boyfriend. Marnie's storyline probably reflects a lot of women's genuine sexual frustrations within relationships...but to the nice guy whose GF keeps pushing him away, it just feels like a punch in the gut. What's the practical takeaway for a girl in this situation? Nothing, because not matter how much of a sexy goddess you are, you can never be a different person.
I point it out because it is true but often not realized.
DeleteAre you are saying ignorance is bliss? If so, then we fundamentally disagree about the importance of knowledge.
No, I think this is just an area of impasse between men and women, and there's no real solution to the "problem." I was just venting my frustration over it more than anything else. I agree a lot of women probably are kind of oblivious to the male sex drive, so it's good to know what you're up against sometimes...
DeleteAndrew, I totally agree with Meadowlark92, it's incredibly sad to think that you can be an awesome girlfriend, a dream girl even, but your boyfriend will inevitably tire of you because you don't have the ability to morph into a different woman every night.
DeleteThe worst part is that when I get into a serious relationship with someone I have no problem being 100% devoted to him. Like I may notice a cute guy on the street, but not in any real way. I will literally in my head think to myself 'he's not as cute as my bf,' and I honestly feel that way. It's devastating to think I'll never get that kind of devotion in return.
I love this blog because your voice is logical and the tips you offer are always actionable for women, but I'm having a tough time parsing out a take-away here. How do you propose I reconcile this information? Is there a silver lining here, or am I literally supposed to accept the fact that I will never truly make a man happy? *slits wrists*
Girls here would be smart to remember that the guy writing this blog is not representative of all men. He is, if I'm not mistaken, single and in his late twenties. Sure, there are plenty of men like the one outlined in this post, but for every man I know of that plays the field, I know another who is head over heels in love with his girlfriend/wife and couldn't care less about "variety". The girl in the story knows this too and senses she's dealing with the former, not the latter, hence she goes to extremes to please him in an attempt to win his devotion.
DeleteGenerally, relationship-oriented men who prioritize family are less prone to this "itch" and more prone to getting married younger. So if you want to avoid men who think this way (and safe to say most women do), better to start seriously thinking about marriage sooner rather than later, before all the good men have been snatched up and the leftovers are the indecisive, hedonistic playboys who aren't exactly excited about settling down with one woman. That's what I take away from this.
Woah - "never truely make a man happy"? When did I say that? I just said that men will always want to have sex with multiple women; I never said they won't be willing to overcome that inclination (in fact I said most do so).
DeleteYou might always want to travel to Paris but never get the opportunity because your husband hates to fly - does that mean he can't make you truely happy?
Or you might sacrifice your career to be a stay-at-home mom because your husband prefers it that way and you want to make him happy; does that mean you can't truely be happy?
In any case like this one partner makes a sacrifice because they believe it is the better alternative - even if there was a lot they liked about what had to be sacrificed to have it. You can definitely still make a man happy despite his inclinations to bang lots of women. If you find a good guy, he's made a conscious choice to give those women up in order to be with you.
I wrote this post mostly to point out that a woman needs to pay close attention to her husband's sexual needs, not to suggest that she can never make him happy.
http://www.evanmarckatz.com/blog/what-do-men-get-out-of-looking-at-other-women-and-why-do-men-cheat/
Delete"Girls here would be smart to remember that the guy writing this blog is not representative of all men."
Delete-------------------------------------------------
It is representative of 99% of men.
For the women who are saddened by this reality, another way to look at it is that your loyal non-cheating bf/husband truly truly loves you. He fights and wins the battle with his animalistic nature over and over again. He fights millions of years of evolution, and wins. For love. That's goddamn romantic if you ask me.
"I wrote this post mostly to point out that a woman needs to pay close attention to her husband's sexual needs, not to suggest that she can never make him happy."
DeleteSeems to me that the girlfriend in your example is paying a LOT of attention to her boyfriend's sexual needs. And it doesn't seem to be working out too well...
I agree with the commenters who state that this is pretty useless information unless you put it in the context of what women can do to combat this or what they can look for in a man to ensure he doesn't give way to his need for variety. A simple "If you want to be in a relationship, do everything you can to find a man who has high character and is trustworthy, because he will suppress his urges out of his love and respect for you" would have gone miles.
To Anonymous, from June 27, 2012 at 2:01 PM:
DeleteBasically, you need to find a good man who will resist those urges out of love for you, like Ethan said. I'm married to a wonderful man, and before I met him, I basically decided I would only marry a good man and that I was willing to fight to find him. It's pretty brutal competition - there are only so many good men to go around - but the good news is there are enough women still fixating on the "exciting bad boys" that at least half the female population isn't going for the same men you are. And as for the half that are? Well, like I said, the competition is brutal.
I worked out five times a week, started dressing better and wearing heels, wore make-up, started hard-core pursuing my own interests, put a lot of time into my spiritual life, started trying to live authentically and vulnerably, and began dating online. I was lucky enough to find an incredible, honorable man. He's still visual, he's still a man, he still has a part of him that would want variety, but he's not a slave to it. He wants his life with me more.
So yeah, no need to despair. Just time to acknowledge the reality that some things are worth fighting for.
"I agree with the commenters who state that this is pretty useless information unless you put it in the context of what women can do to combat this or what they can look for in a man to ensure he doesn't give way to his need for variety."
DeleteMe too. Thankfully the post is written in the context of this whole blog.
Why do you assume monogamy is the default? What do you get out of it? You can behave like the French and look the other way with his mistress. You could become swingers or have an open relationship. The best thing you could do is to bring another girl to bed with you two now an then, understanding that he's not looking to replace you with her and will think you're the best girlfriend ever...a rare find to never give up. Or, at a bare minimum, you can have some kind of appreciation of what he's going through...for you. If a guy is giving up the variety for you, he REALLY likes you.
DeleteSaying this info is useless is very illustrative of female selfishness. It doesn't benefit you directly, so it's useless.
Saying"the best thing you could do is bring another girl to bed" is a man's selfishness. Not to mention you touted that, and in the next breath talked about how selfish women are!!!
DeleteYeah, who is Greg, really? LOL
ReplyDeleteThis is my worst nightmare. That you're the best girlfriend ever but still not enough. What to do?
I AM GREG
DeleteWhat do you get out of his monogamy? You can behave like the French and look the other way with his mistress. You could become swingers or have an open relationship. The best thing you could do is to bring another girl to bed with you two now an then, understanding that he's not looking to replace you with her and will think you're the best girlfriend ever...a rare find to never give up. Or, at a bare minimum, you can have some kind of appreciation of what he's going through...for you. If a guy is giving up the variety for you, he REALLY likes you.
DeleteI AM GREG
DeleteI think the best thing to do is just to not give quite as much or constantly be around the guy. I imagine if his girl spends so much time cleaning for him, etc., she probably isn't putting much time into her own hobbies and friends. If she let him miss her and gave him room to put in the effort sometimes, maybe he would start to desire and respect her more.
ReplyDeletethis really pains me for some reason!it just makes me sad that this is the sad reality of most men. it hurts me that i can be near perfect but my man will still have wondering eyes and to the world its okay,.,.because well he is biologically inclined to feel that way. it hurts me to know that he will be thinking it even if he doesnt vocalize it. but most importantly a stronger part of me feels that for all men impulse and uncontrollable desires says you could, but emotional maturity and selflessness wont let u!this to me seperates the boys from the men!
ReplyDelete"this to me seperates the boys from the men!"
DeleteI agree. It also demonstrates foresight.
It's almost as if women were objects, disposable and interchangeable ones.
ReplyDeleteBiologically, aren't they?
Deleteno, no they are not
Deletebiologically, we're all objects.
DeleteI have a wife, we just had a baby girl. I've loved my wife since we started dating in high-school (17 years ago). Throughout the years, we've gone through a lot together and I respect her and will never leave her. She's been a great friend, we've shared so much (good and bad) that the bond I have with her can never be broken. However, after our baby was born, She lost all interest in sex. Since we got pregnant, we've had sex 4 times in the last 28 months. We talked about it and it led us to understand each other's needs. We had a fun night together, including intimacy and sex, but almost a week after, I'm thinking about sex with a different woman. Different woman as in body type, and sexual taste. I just wanna try something different, like a different flavor ice cream. As I said, I love my wife, and will never leave her for any reason: I wish she realized that and let me play.
DeleteI think this is why women find it so offensive! You love your wife but just wish she would let you play? To all the men out there who just want to have sex with lots of other women and who allow themselves to be tormented by these desires? Need to learn to control them instead of feeding them. We are women not screw toys. We are not our body's. We only reside in them. We are wonderful amazing beautiful and powerful souls, with a huge capacity to love. When we open up and give that love to you, sex is the way we can express it through our body's. How could we not be offended that when we do' the man we give ourselves to just wants someone else? It seems like a case of lack of gratitude to me? At the very least a waste of energy being that none of those women you want to have sex with will want to reduce themselves to some sex toy for you to play with. I think a change of heart is what is really at the core of this issue. Men will find they won't have nearly the struggle when they learn to look at women as individual souls instead of body parts. Especially their wife. Then maybe they would see the real value of what their wife is giving them. Instead of obsess on getting a woman who is not offering them much of anything. Only in their own mind
DeleteExactly right, anon. It IS a case of a lack of gratitude. Men have allowed themselves to become obsessed with sex. This whole culture of obsession with "fucking multiple chicks" stems from the fact that men only see women as screw toys. They don't pay as much attention to all the other aspects of a relationship. It's all about "fucking hot chicks" to them. And that's what taught in this society.
DeleteYou can find biology as offensive as you please- it doesn't change anything. This guys wife isn't even attempting to meet his needs. If she won't, then someone else should. It's offensive to me that you expect him to live a sexless life for no reason whatsoever.
DeleteWomen are so deluded to think that the man should be trapped in a sexless marriage. He has the right to look because she is failing him. He is not thinking of body parts, he is thinking of the desire to bond in a physical way. Men are not enemies. Some are bad eggs, many just have normal human instincts.
DeleteAlso when the man says he will never leave her. Hes a fool, not many women will want to lend themselves as an object. Dude probably deserves nothing. He needs to have the balls to either do something about it or not, not cry about how much he loves her and so if he does find a sex toy ... its somehow okay to use them. that is really the sick part.
I have a question in relation to this. I read somewhere that men are less likely to forgive women for cheating than the other way around. That makes sense in a way - given that women are more likely to cheat if they are unhappy in a relationship, whereas men can cheat even if they are happy. If a woman has cheated on her bf/spouse, she was most likely not satisfied by her partner, which I suppose adds to the 'humiliation' factor.
ReplyDeleteGiven that men cheat for the reasons mentioned in this post - a natural drive and a craving for sexual variety - do you think it makes more sense for a woman to forgive a cheating man?
I know you are not justifying the male sex drive here, you're just passing information. But I assume you give this info because being aware of it should make some kind of difference? Do you think that more people should be open to the idea of an open relationship? Or be more 'forgiving' about the male desire for variety?
That's a good question... I've wondered that many times. In one sense, yes, I do think that a woman should be more forgiving of a man because his temptation to cheat is stronger and less emotionally-driven. That being said, I don't think a woman should put up with bullshit from her man, and if he can't stop himself from cheating (out of respect for her), there are problems.
DeleteI don't think I can give a categorical answer here. A lot depends on th length and depth of the relationship, how much the man cared about the woman he cheated with, WHY he cheated (was his wife not satisfying him due to her own laziness or lack of commitment?), etc.
Every case is every case.
Cheating is unforgiveable no matter what. Just because men have a so called "biological inclination" doesn't give them a free pass to cheat. We're not merely animals. We are MUCH more complex. We have a sense of shame, loyalty, dignity, etc etc. We're not JUST animals, and there is NO excuse for cheating. NONE. If you're not happy in the relationship, break up. Don't cheat. And no, a woman should NOT forgive a cheater. How dare you even suggest that women should forgive a cheating man just because he's a man?
DeleteWhy is giving up sexual variety a condition of your relationship in the first place? Why not, say, giving up eating sugar? They're similar drives, but the latter is much weaker.
DeleteSo as hypergamy is to women, the "itch" is to men?
ReplyDeleteThat's not a terrible way of thinking about it, though I am not sure those two desires are entirely analgous.
DeleteThey are analogous. Entirely.
DeleteIt's about maximizing the quantity and quality of your offspring.
Female have a "quantity" restraint, so they value "quality" much higher than men.
Men do not have a "quantity" restraint, so they, biologically, want to impregnate anything they can get away with.
Usually, for a man, "quantity" is restrained by shotgun owned by the females father.
Or in other words, historically, other men have been the restraint on mens "quantity" variable.
Dying sucks more than not impregnating. A beating... it's worth considering. Only a chance of getting a beating... probably worth it.
I was referring to the fact that Hypergamy is the extension or conclusion of the woman's desire for high quality offspring (i.e. that drive applied to marriage), it isn't the drive or "itch" itself.
DeleteFemale drive for quality : Male drive for quantity
Hypergamy : Promiscuity
It's really just semantics. The idea is solid.
Except that Hypergamy is endorsed by the current culture, while promiscuity is shunned.
DeleteThe female hypergamous itch is very real and... eh... itchy if the female thinks she can have better, but is stuck with the looser.
Bitchy female = itchy male (all rights reserved)
There is a t-shirt deal in your future. Biggest sales: boardwalk at the Jersey Shore.
Delete#thesituationsnewuniform
Oh dear, it looks to me that your friend is bored because his girlfriend made the mistake of being hot in every conceivable way. Sorry Andrew, I don't buy your explanation. Everyone gets bored when the going is good for too long. A chocolate sundae every day is boring, especially when you don't have to do anything to procure it.
ReplyDeleteWomen take note. Do not do everything for your man - even if you want to. Besides; you have no business doing so until he is your husband. This lust for lots of women is encouraged because too many women give it up easily. There's a lot of options out there. If Andrew's post offends you, you need to expose yourself to what men in the manosphere are saying. Try this:
http://boldanddetermined.com/2012/01/21/pick-the-right-wife/
Yep, if you're expecting men to be loyal just because you're hot and willing you need to wake up. Hot and willing is freely available these days.
In a sense, it's true that a girl-game can increase monogamy in a man. However, it does not mean that men are just "bored" and having it too good.
DeleteYou don't find that in other areas. "My job is too good, I'm thinking about quiting."
Here is a formula:
If yamo is greater than (nara + girl-game) Then
increase itch with the difference
Else
increase itch with a little bit.
End if
yamo = male sexual currency
nara = female sexual currency
were i add everything into "sexual currency", not only obvious physical traits.
If yamo is bigger than nara, then the girl can help it with girl-game, but the underlying biology is still there.
Computer logic. Wow.
DeleteThat, my friends, is officially the nerdiest comment that has ever been posted on this blog.
I am kind of on the fence about whether that is pathetic or awesome. But I am leaning towards awesome - and have lost all interest in writing a serious response.
Then you should have seen the original version, the one i toned down after realizing that most people don't read VB.NET code ;)
DeleteCan you perhaps write a post about connections/friendships and how the social circles influence dating?
ReplyDeleteI'm 22 and I generally get a lot of attention from guys. I'm shy and not super sociable so that's something for me to work on. I've maybe relied a bit on my looks, it gets me noticed, and from experience it is something that can make guys talk about me. I've experienced guys mentioning it to friends if we've been on a date.
I don't want a LDR, but I live in a big city and would prefer an 'urban' guy, from a city, say maximum 2 hrs away. The social circles are still quite small. At least in the school/work/party environment I'm in. The two last guys I dated happened to know each other, even though they were from the same town of 8 million. I don't want a reputation for someone who's dated someone's friends. If a I meet a new attractive guy from a background similar to mine, I can see he's got 40 mutual facebook friends to the last guy I dated (to make it worse - as an introvert, I'm attracted to extroverts, so the guys I've dated are all very social and well-connected).
Are most guys very concerned about this? And do guys really talk as much as girls?
Guys will care about this in proportion to the strength of their friendship. I actually have a posts about this already that you can check out (Bros Before Hos"). Just because a person has friends on facebook, though, doesn't mean they are close. They could just be acquaintences, in which case it won't matter.
DeleteHave you tried meeting guys in bars?
Males have a larger social network than females, but it's shallower with less expectations, and thus, less drama.
DeleteFemales have higher expectations, witch results in more drama, but more emotional depth.
Check out polyamory... There's another way. (Also, read Sex at Dawn?)
ReplyDeleteSusan on HUS wrote a post on emotional escalation a while ago... I was wondering if you were planning to do a similar post from a man's POV? If you DO believe that emotional escalation is the woman's job and the physical escalation is the man's job.
ReplyDeleteI generally get a lot of attention from guys, especially on my looks, but I have yet to form a serious bond with a man. I've thought I had in the past, but it turned out to be all in my head. I'm not promiscuous and do not send signals that I am, but relationships with men easily turn all physical. I'm a bit shy but not so much that I think it's a serious problem. Men can easily develop 'crushes' on me and get obsessed for a while, but then the dopamine rush runs out or whatever. I've had an experience where everything seemed perfect and he was all over me and then just disappeared.
Any advice on this?
Don't have sex before he commits.
DeletePerhaps I'm just seeing the wrong guys here, but I feel like there is a limit to how much 'commitment' you can get before sex these days? From my last relationship, we had both made it clear we were not casual sex-people, and he had said he wasn't seeing other girls.
DeleteShould I attempt to make a guy say he sees himself with me in the long haul before we have sex?
What matters is not whether or not he IS seeing other girls, but whether or not he WANTS to see other girls.
DeleteI'd say don't have sex with him until he has made it clear to you that he will not see other girls without telling you first.
Why this happens, i deduce: he wants a variety if women to have sex with, and is playing field. 80 percent chance, that is what happened. It doesn't matter how good you lpok, from this post....he will still want others, sexually. You don't trump other girls that way; you are a dime a dozen.
DeleteWhat seems to be missing for all this is a serious look at biology ( not the pseudo-science sort that has been pasted elsewhere in this thread) and human history.
Delete1) There is no species on the planet where the female courts the male. It is written into the DNA of the planet that the male is less valuable biologically speaking (sperm are plentiful and cheap and males are expendable). Males in general do not get the chance to breed. Only the top-grade 'alpha' males do. This ensures that the best genes are passed on to the next generation. All females get to breed and reproduce (they are inherently biologically valuable). Only a few males get to 'have sex' and breed.
2) Fast forward to human society. It would still serve female humans best if they only got to breed with the best, top-grade males (and this existed for a while - to an extent - with the harem system). The lesser (drone) males felt a huge urge for sex (i.e to breed) but had no chance. Therefore they had to satisfy the urge by anal relief (hence the hunger for anal sex in drone males today)- and, most importantly , they were ALWAYS ON THE LOOKOUT FOR ANY OPPORTUNITY TO JUMP IN AND HAVE QUICK SEX WITH A FEMALE IF THE ALPHA MALE WASN'T AROUND. That is where the present day urge for 'variety of partners' comes in. It's related to having a heritage as an inferior, drone male who was laws on the lookout for what he could scavenge. (Read on)
However, males began to stop competing with each other (fighting, killing) and instead became 'buddies', turned a violent, prohibitive, controlling eye upon female behaviour and insisted on monogamy - so that each male could have at least one female. Nice for the individual male - he gets to breed and be assured of offspring - something most never had before. Not so good for the female. She is tied to one male. All her offspring are from the same gene pool. If it's crap, all her offspring have crap genes. Previously she was assured of of good genes from the top-grade males. Now she has to have regular 'sex' with a sub-standard male. The world becomes quickly filled with lots of genetically inferior humans (N.B. Look around you today - how many people do you know who do not have some kind of defect or disability?).
3) As human society progresses, we are born and grow up in this world and it all seems 'normal'. The inferior drone males still feel the urges they used to 'way back when' and are unable to deal with /process actually having sexual access to a top flight human ( a woman) on a regular basis. So there is programming - yes. But it doesn't have its basis in men-needing-to-spread-their-genes. That's simply not good for the species. We need only the best genes. That means cutting out most males from the reproduction process.
We're in a sick situation. I've simplified some things and left out some other relevant stuff e.g.menstruation and its effects, simply to keep this post as short as possible (haha) but much that we understand today as 'normal' has its roots in happenstance. Of course, that's true of everything that happens. Capitalism has helped it along too.
Be careful what you wish for in regard to women being amenable to multiple partners. That would eventually result in them gravitating back to selection of top-grade males as breeding partners (harem system) and most of you guys would be left out. That would take some generations though....
What are your opinions on "taking another woman's man"? I don't mean actually stealing a man, because I don't think you can, he has to walk willingly. But if a man wants to leave his current gf for you, does this indicate that he is flaky and likely to do the same to you? Do you think women should aim to find a guy who's been single for a certain amount of time to make sure they're not a rebound/replacement?
ReplyDeleteIt doesnt necessarily mean he is flakey, no. It could just mean he likes you a lot more than her. I wouldn't worry too much about making sure he's single or has been for a while. What you want to be careful of is a guy who won't break up with his girl before getting intimate with you - and I don't mean sex. If he respects the women he dates, he will end things with her before really getting involved with you. Flirting is probably tolerable, but if you are hanging out together or kissing and he is doing it behind his girl's back - run.
DeleteAlthough I'm sure plenty of women hate reading this, I have to add that when you REALLY stop and think about it, it is amazing how long the same body is interesting to a man. You can sleep with him more than once a day for a very long time, and when you take your top of, he has the same excitement for your breasts as before (might add that the male interest in breasts can never really be understood by women - every second person in the world has them...).
ReplyDeleteI just read the post on how the sex drive always recharges - as long as you're with a man who won't give up on what he has with you for variety, you'll see he's more than interested in still having sex with you.
I agree with this.
DeleteA sexually starved man will be much more easily turned on. The more sex a man has, the more stimuli will be required to be turned on.
DeletePorn raises the bar.
Porn lowers the bar. He just has to look at a magazine or online video to be stimulated. Rather than engaging with a whole human being. It dehumanises him. Porn is generic. Sex is personal.
DeleteHaha so I did get something right - I've always been a believer in the 100 mile rule, which if you're not familiar with it is if your bf/hubby is going on a business trip out of town or whatever and he meets an attractive woman on the trip and they want to have sex, as far as I'm concerned they have my blessing.
ReplyDeleteBefore you think I'm insane, there are very well thought out reasons I believe in this.
* Being bi I actually do have some clue what it's like for guys, when i've been with the same guy for about 3 years or more I start to miss sex with a girl.. and it's missing that completely superficial lust driven sex i'd rather not feel I want but I do. Though from reading this it's not anywhere near as strong as what guys experience.
* Him getting some on the side /as long as/ he never prefers that to having sex with me has in my experience actually been good for our relationship
* People who don't get it will immediately think let him have threesomes, but there are very good reasons I will not allow that, plus I don't actually want to be directly involved in the "having some on the side".
* I want his encounters to be one-offs, having them be women that doesn't live in the same city encourages that.
* I don't want it to happen too often.
* I've ended up finding I bonded over the stories if he chooses to tell me, I ask not to hear the details of the actual sex, but anything else he wants to tell me is fair game. Most guys choose to tell me, that is after it actually sinks in that I really won't react negatively which takes significant time as they seem to think there must be some innate biological deadman switch which makes a woman go psycho if he has sex with anyone else. It's not actually true, it's about trust.
I should make it clear that me getting to have sex with women is not part of the deal. The reason is guys care about fidelity much more than they are given credit for, they actually care more than women do.
What do I get out of it?
1. I actually trust him more, because we talk about things which are considered to be "off limits", but yet still needs to be addressed.
2. It keeps him hot for me.
That said you /really/ have to have your shit together to be able to have a rule like this. When I first discuss it, the guy will then start testing me to see what I will let him get away with, they can't help it. As soon as they cross a line, I have to say "if you ever break these rules again, we're done.". Don't yell, don't act mad and don't let him try to negotiate. He will just say "OK", but deep down he feels worse for what he's done that he would if you'd told him how hurt you were; though he'll never admit it.
I know exactly how this is. I feel as if I could be your find in this conversation, as the situation with my last gf was so similar. Idk what to do about it. She treated me like a king, was fun, smart, not bitchy at all, sex anywhere, anytime, anyway, and yet I still screwed it up.
ReplyDeleteThis attitude is part of what makes me so attractive to women, but its also a curse for relationships.
I have actually no idea how easy/difficult it is for a man to get laid or get an attractive woman.
ReplyDeleteI know this varies a lot with a guy's confidence, but can you say something about how difficult it actually is for a good looking or average looking guy to get a girl home in a bar in a big city? Is it something that happens often for you or your friends?
It is very easy to get laid with a woman less attractive than yourself. I'd say that if a guy wants sex on any given Friday night, he can get it if he has decent social skills and is willing to take a 3-point dive. Having a one night stand with a girl who is at an equal level or hotter is very difficult, but not impossible. Read the post titled "Women Get To Play Out of Their League"
DeleteThis post is right that men are polygamous in their instincts and desire multiple women.However this varies between men depending on their family, religious and social background. As a man matures he realises that these physical encounters become meaningless without real intimacy.
ReplyDeleteThe guy in this scenario is not ready for a serious relationship ie marriage with his gf.His gf is holding on and hoping he will be but its unlikely he will.Once a woman emotionally bonds to a man its very difficult to eliminate him from her life, there's a hormone called oxytocin that induces bonding in females during orgasm. The effects on men are far less pronounced.
From everything Ive read about relationships it seems men settle down when they are ready to and that timing is the most important factor.So a guy will dump a hot girl if he's not ready to commit and marry a less attractive girl later down the line when he wants to setlle down. Do you think this is true?
Actually, I do. At least, I think it is true for many men. Part of this is just the guy "feeling out" the market in his early years, getting and idea of where he stands and how well he can do. I don't know if I agree that men will end up with a girl less attractive than one they dated previously, but I do agree that time plays heavily into a man's decision to get married, almost to the extreme that you might claim "it's not who, it's when."
DeleteThank you for the reply,its something Ive seen with a few male friends over the years.They've rejected/dumped attractive women believing they will get someone better down the line and have then married someone with average looks.So I too feel timing is key for a guy otherwise this behaviour doesn't make sense.
DeleteThe mistake women make is holding on too long to a guy who isn't ready in the belief he will be.I have many female friends in their thirties who've done this and waited years to learn this lesson the hard way.Its better to cut loose and find someone new, I know you've addressed this in a post so thanks again!
"This post is right that men are polygamous"
DeleteYou meant polygynous.
"become meaningless without real intimacy"
Purely biologically, a man does not need emotional intimacy in order to impregnate. A female needs emotional intimacy in order to leverage a commitment.
"The effects on men are far less pronounced."
I read that testosteron cancels out the soothing effect of oxytocyn. Oxytocyn is also vital for breastfeeding and to induce labor.
"Do you think this is true?"
Purely from a biological standpoint, there is no need for a man to stay monogamous, even if he currently is with a impregnated female. Since he is providing for her needs, she can't force him to stop.
If she manages to induce love into him, it will lower his desire for other women (tests have shown).
For the male, it doesn't bring any negative side effects if he impregnates a second female.
For the female, she risks receiving less of the males resources.
Unless there is social pressure, or threat from other males, why would he not follow his biological instincts?
For the male, having the female engaging in sex with another male raises paternity issues, incentives him to cut of resources.
Here is my take on it:
ReplyDeleteMales categorise females into two groups:
females with whom you can assume their children will be yours (wife-material)
females with whom you can not assume so (sluts)
from a male perceptive, there is no contradiction between spending resources on a wife-material female, and having fun with sluts.
I'm sure that if it was socially acceptable, men would marry to a wife-material as soon as they got their first job, and have fun with sluts, without a significant chance for the wife-material to be abandoned, as long as she was pleasing.
Why would he?
That would really lower the attractiveness of being a slut.
If it also was socially acceptable to have more than one wife, provided that he could financially care for both of them, it would incentives men to be significantly more productive.
Here is a guess: Women are much more aggravated by the thought of receiving less or none of the males resources (this includes attention), than the thought of him having fun with other women.
Or put it in another way. If there were fully realistic sex-bots, and there will be soon, would you really mind if he went for a ride now and then?
it must be a real drag to be with a woman that for the most part is perfect for you yet you feel the pull to explore new territory. I am with my beautiful milf wife 24 yrs now and i am still captivated by every part of her and she likewise.
ReplyDeleteI'm happy for you. And I'm very happy that there are men out there who are truly satisfied with their wives. I don't want to have to put in all my effort and energy, only to find out that my husband/boyfriend is dreaming about other women, and that I'm not enough no matter what I do. It must be a real drag to be with a man who just doesn't appreciate the perfect wife that he has.
Deletemilf? Who is the father/s? How many children? How long have you been together? How many women have you had before her?
ReplyDeleteI want to thank you for this article. And some of the insightful comments too. The not-so-insightful ones were also good for a laugh.
ReplyDeleteI want to challenge the notion that several people have brought up... that the only reason for wandering eyes is that "she's too perfect", "too dedicated" or "too loyal". I see this perception as simple denial that it's possible for a girl to do everything right and still not be enough.
Truth is ugly like that. It doesn't mean its not possible to turn a man off with being a little too nice. It doesn't mean that it's impossible to make a man happy with one woman. But all men? Alas, most definitely, there are some who cannot be satisfied.
I'm afraid I might be one such man. I love my girlfriend to death. She is gorgeous, funny, sweet, and loyal. But I am powerfully attracted to many women daily, and while I don't intend to cheat, I know that if I could have my cake and eat it too, I would pursue sex with new girls indefinitely. My girlfriend cannot even comprehend this, and no matter how carefully I approach the topic, it is painfully frustrating for the both of us. As Meadowlark92 mentioned, this feels like just an impasse for men and women. There's a mismatch in fundamental direction that cannot be overcome.
I found this page because I needed to see how others are dealing with it.
Ive been dating a man for over a year and a half who has a history of being a serial cheater and has multiple children. I was married for many years and divorced; met this man several years.later. I have come to learn that I have been extremely naive about the primative sexual instincts of men. Im older, considerable very attractive, open minded, independent, not clingy, and gives him plenty of space. My downfall was believing him that we would discuss his desires and deal with them. Just from his past alone, it shows he lacks control but I didn't learn how bad it was until I had bonded. He had to admit to one affair but I believe he has many. He wants to impregnate every one he has a relationship with, or at least the young ones and tells them he wants to marry all while telling me he is monogamous and he wants to marry me. I've learned all if this recently and now feel so used. I naively believed that because he was middle aged now, he's learned to control himself and he convinced me he has met the right person; although I had no attention in marrying him, I loved him and enjoyed him immensely.
ReplyDeleteSorry to hear. :(
DeleteThis guy sounds like a nutter. Seriously no self-control and sounds like he needs therapy. There are much better guys out there.
I agree. I definitely believe that men who have these temptations or "urges" or even cheaters have psychological problems. Having a lot of encounters shows himself that he is "the man" and he is powerful. But in the end, he is still not satisfied. I agree this dude needs some therapy.
DeleteAbsolutely .. I dumped him as he appear Bipolar and AN Antisocial personality disorder sufferer.
ReplyDeleteThis is just so painful but confirms what I've long sensed a lot of men feel. I'm 29, single and I think part of my reason for still not being married is the fear of having the man I love more than anything in the world desiring other women, no matter how "perfect" he thinks I am. Although I know I would make a very loyal, loving, supportive and caring partner, I also tend to be very jealous and possessive, so I'm not sure how I could cope with my man having these feelings for other women, especially as I begin to age.
ReplyDeleteWhat I don't get is how so many guys want sexual variety, but can get crazy jealous and possessive if their significant other looks or talks to another man. It just seems so hypocritical.
ReplyDeleteI agree. A relationship should be equal. I used to be very possesive of my wife, determined to be her one and only lover and vowed that I'de never have sex with another. To this day, I hold true to my promise, but my attitude has changed: I want to have sex with other women, just to play. My wife and I will never part, but to expect such a selfless act of trust, I've had to let go of my possessive, jealous streak. A relationship is a two way street. Give and take need to be equal.
DeleteIt's less hypocritical and more biological: Read the reply from 'Anonymous January 3, 2013 at 6:21 PM' up a few scrolls. It likely stems from paternity concerns; we're all apes though we like to view ourselves as more sophisticated.
Deletefrom a biological perspective...
Deletea woman always knows that her child is hers, no matter how many men she has sex with, and no matter how many women her husband has sex with.
a man only knows his child is his if his wife is monogamous.
therefore it's more "harmful" when a woman cheats.
Not saying this is your fault, you're spreading the truth we all should know. But reading this blog only makes a woman more hopeless because it confirms her suspicions about what men are like. If men are like this, then what's the point? It's just depressing to even look him because you know what he really wants to do.
ReplyDeleteIm glad hes spreading the word. Most women are so naiive about men and think they are so great and essential to their happiness.
DeleteYou dont need a man to be happy so it shouldnt be too depressing.
I love being single and bat men away from me...all my married/in LTR girlfriends see how happy I am and are jealous.
Learn to be friends with men but detach and see them for what they are. You dont NEED a man to be happy at all.
Why is it that when you hear of men cheating on their wives or girlfriends, you hear that the paramour is much less attractive then the girl they are currently with - and when you see them - its confirmed. It is the strangest thing ever. Every time I hear of a man cheating, and I learn of the individual, and on the chance I get to put a face to a name, she is less attractive, I dare so almost ugly when compared to the woman he was dating or married to was. Why is this?
ReplyDeleteYou just read the answer....it's the subject of this article. Men generally don't cheat because they're looking for an upgrade, they do it for the biological urge for variety. A woman a couple notches below them can be attracted with far less investment.
Deletebecause variety is what he's after. he doesn't require the new girl be hotter than the old girl, because he isn't necessarily unsatisfied with the attractiveness of the old girl. he just craves variety.
ReplyDeleteI really don't see why there's a big discussion here. Men have to suppress their urge for more than one sexual partner more or less in the same way as a women needs to suppress her urges (sexual or for higher status). Its human to want variety, its not limited to either gender. I don't think there's a need to take it negatively, if you love someone, you make an active choice for everyone else to fade to the background...
ReplyDeleteI don't put much stock into this line of reasoning:
ReplyDelete"Me: It's that animal instinct, man. When the hunt is over the thought of a new body starts to creep into the back of your mind - a new body with new curves, new hair and new lips... we are wired to feel that way. If men didn't want to fuck as much as we do, humans wouldn't have evolved anywhere near as quickly as we have. It's just our genetics trying to propagate the species."
It seems like self justification, but more importantly, not very deeply or honestly examined - maybe it was, but something about it does not sit right.
Also, the conclusion of the post is rather left hanging...
Ehhh this is why I dont believe in marriage. Men are wired to always be resentful/unhappy after being with the same girl for a long time...doesnt matter how great his wife/girlfriend is, at some point they become bored and need to fuck other girls.
ReplyDeleteThe idea of being tied down to somebody who has to fight his urges everyday to not cheat on me sounds like a colossal waste of time.
When I worked at a nursing home for years, all the old ladies told me that boyfriends expire after 2 years (maximum)...hence thats when all men become unappreciate and lazy. That was good advice.
As for using evolution to excuse this behavior...well too bad men dont let women use evolution to excuse wanting them to make more money. Double standards
Exactly! Sounds like men are a big waste of time and energy. Apparently not cheating on your wife is considered romantic now. What the fuck?
DeleteExactly right. It makes me wonder why, in the day and age of paternity tests and safe sex, we even bother with monogamy. It's outlived its usefulness and is now actually harmful to relationships.
Deletewomen cheat just as much. just for different reasons.
Deleteyh I get that...I mean I'm single but I'm into about five different guys, and even if I got with one of them, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't just STOP liking the other guys, you're always gonna wanna get with other people, it's all about just respecting the other enough to not say so in front of them! xD
ReplyDeleteI think it is funny that the fact that women also like variety is never adressed. To all the men out there, yes we do and we have fantasies with other men and (shocker) we like sex just as much as you.
ReplyDeleteI think it is very stupid to excuse cheating though and it is stupid that men tend to blame everything on evolution whenever it's convenient.
Women aren't naturally supposed to stay with one man their whole life either (in some cultures it was even normal to have more than one husband) and not every woman cheats because of emotional reasons. Sometimes we also just want sex with no strings attached.
The thing is we have a brain that gives us the possibility to make a choice and when we settle down, we make a choice and should keep promises. I can't stand the lame justifications of cheating.
I am now 12 years in marriage. I love my wife. I have a crazy urge to have sex with other girls. I pray so much about the urge going away, but it may disappear for a few days, and looms up again stronger. It is so puzzling that I had to google to find out why men have this urge when I ran into this post. I guess we are wired that way. Some ladies don't seem to understand how tough it is to fight this urge, but I like Ethan's statement, whenever we win the urge, we do it for love. The weird thing is, its not just a sexual urge, but an urge to share your feelings, joy, emotions, love, tenderness, gentleness, and love another lovely creature.
ReplyDeleteEver wondered why King Solomon had 300 wives, and 700 concubines? If I could have my way, I would be married to not less than 100 women.
I've been married 7 years now and I feel your pain. All the males on this blog feel your pain. The women don't understand and never will. Fight the good fight my friend.
DeleteHaha. You men are so funny. Really. Most of you ARE emotionally immature and have no idea what you want. I came to this blog by searching for tips on what to do when the woman has a higher sex drive than their man. I was in a LTR for 16yrs and left the minute I started thinking I'd like to have some variety - because I had self respect and respect for my partner. I was raised by a good man, and lucky enough to be in that LTR for so long with a good man. It is through that foundation with good men I now know the difference between the good the bad and the ugly.
ReplyDeleteWhen I left that LTR and got the variety I wanted, it was good, it was fun, and kind of like being allowed to eat all the bad food I wanted. I am one of those rare women who love sex and have an insatiable appetite. Love men and big d*cks, all day every day. I say that so the silly 'boys' out there understand there are women who feel needs just like if not more than you. Think of it this way, men have the biological need to spread their seed. But how am I to know that his seed is good enough, the fittest enough seed for my biological need? I only have one egg per month with a relatively small percentage chance of fertilization monthly if trying to conceive. It makes much more biological sense I get as much viable (genetic variation) seed as possible so the best, fittest one gets the egg. Duh. But I like to be healthy. Keep my mind spirit and body healthy. Part of that is a healthy relationship - it's been proven for a long healthy life good relationships are important. Not the 'having a different flavor of ice cream and cake' every night attitude. That's not what you'll remember on your death bed, trust me.
I'm all for variety. When single. If you've chosen a person to commit to and be in a relationship with, go all out, give it all you have. GO BIG OR GO HOME. Nut up or shut up. Focus on being in the moment with your chosen partner - if you're feeling that itch or that need for variety I say have the self respect and the respect for your partner to let them find a man who wants the same thing. That's what I do, and boy can I sleep much better at night secure in the notion I'm doing the right thing and being the best human possible, not just giving in to the superficial.
All these justifications for cheating spouses usually have to do with "spreading seed" because of evolutionary reasons. But let's think about it. How many people actually cheat to impregnate someone else? Not even one man is goes around thinking "I'd like to impregnate that woman to produce biologically diverse babies". Men want to fuck, not make babies. Using evolution as their justification for their cheating urges is just plain pathetic, ignorant, and immature.There is NO excuse for cheating.
ReplyDeleteIt's not a conscious thing, it's evolution. The reason men want to fuck a lot of women is that men who want to do this have more offspring than those who don't, unintentionally of course.
DeleteLOL. The girlfriend is "away for a couple weeks." Where exactly? Andrew's friend Greg is oh, so certain he's the only one in his girlfriend's eye that he doesn't realize his girlfriend might be playing the doting girlfriend because she's stoinking her boss and she's away for a 2 week stoinkfest. She's guilty, so she's trying to distract him by being the "best girlfriend ever." I've seen this happen.
ReplyDeleteWell, it goes both ways. I think many men like to walk around as if they're so special that they're the only man in their woman's eyes. The reality is there is such a big double standard about women having a lot of partners that we simply lie about it. I'm not bothered by the fact that a guy, my guy would want to fuck another woman, but this is always easier said than done. Part of the reason why I never cheated was frankly, I could never find a suitable guy & I didn't have the time. Same for most guys.
Ego is the main thing. A man always wants to think "Yeah, I could bang her" so little woman you'd better keep in line.
Well, it works both ways . . . . it works both ways.
Interestingly enough I remember reading women's mags from over 30 years ago discussing the problem of women fantasizing about other men while having sex with their husbands. This was always a huge deal. "Dear Abby, whenever I have sex with my husband, I keep fantasizing the postman is fucking me. How can I stop?"
LOL, keep dreaming Andrew that all the girls who sleep with you are orgasming because of you.
Does this mean we should just tolerate men who cheat because it's in their instincts?
ReplyDeleteNo, I definitely did not say that. I was more aiming at the conclusion that you should place a lot less value on the sexual attention that you get from men. It means much less coming from most men than it does coming from most women.
DeleteNo, you should never tolerate this because a REAL MAN does not cheat.
DeleteGive me a break, all men will cheat given the urge at the moment, the opportunity, and the attractiveness of said opportunity. Nope, doesn't mean you should tolerate it, another female missing the point of the article and of the evolutionary explanation. It's just that, an explanation, an insight into the why we feel the way we do, and that it's not purposefully malicious.
Delete@VP Fogstripe... so, if we shouldn't tolerate it, what should we do if we find out our significant other has cheated? I mean, I guess there is no one-size-fits all solution. But a lot of women DO forgive.
DeleteI think the only problem is that we don't live in harmony with what nature has set for us.
ReplyDeleteA man wants multiple women in his wife because his primary need is sex. Eventhough he may be married or in a relationship he will not stop to scan the environment. A womens primary need is be protected and this is shown through love and commitment. So one man can satisfy her primary need, but every man should have freedom to have other women next to his.
No I don't say that nature did not set conditions and that every man deserves this. When you look at most relationships the men have no ambition, don't look after themselves phisicaly, don't educate themselves about life and don't show affection to their wifes through gifts, nice words and helping them (that's what I observed). So they end in a stuck realtionship and now these same men want to have other women. To tell you the honest truth, I don't think they deserved the right to have other women. The wife will think that he has only her and she barely gets affection etc. from him, so how much time and energy will he dedicate to her when he has a second women. You can't blame the women for thinking so, that's just in her genes. And when it comes to the point where she caughts her man cheating, she will loose every bit of respect for him because he was not man enough to say what he wants and she also has every right to that.
Now a man who is the exact opposite of the man described above, a man who protects his loved ones, is passionate about life and strives to achive higher and higher goals has the right to have other women. He shows his wife through his deeds ( not words) that he can handle more than women and provide for them. He should have the freedom of having sex with every women he sees, but you can be sure that his wife will stay his queen for the emotional aspects of a relationship he can have only with one women, but concerning the phisycal he needs mor than one. That does not even mean that he cares alot about other women. That just means he is attracted to hear body. Every man that sees a women he likes wants to sleep with her, but that does not mean that he loves them. So his wife can be sure that he will not get rid of her because of a slut that he met a few days ago.
This is the way nature has set things and it would be in all our interests to live in harmony with them because what we get from living the other way everyone can observe: Divorces, Stuck marriages, broken trust etc.
Ryan - dude, I don't know what the problem is, but it clear that YOU ARE NOT READY FOR MARRIAGE. Something's wrong with everything you're saying, in a weird way. Men should be faithful to women they marry, but they should also NOT marry when they don't want to. Respect yourself and DO NOT PUT YOURSELF IN A SITUATION YOU ARE NOT FULLY PREPARED TO HANDLE. Is someone pressuring you to get married against your will? [Living in harmony with what nature has set for us? Do you ACTUALLY believe that? Sounds like some brainwashing that you need to avoid.]
DeleteWell, I think that the so called problem began when I had a realization a few years ago.
DeleteAfter I found my ,,true love'' 5 times and everytime it didn't end well and after seeing most of the people in traditional marriages feeling stuck I knew that the way a man and a women should have a relationship is not right the way society dictates it. So now I don't think that marriage is a necessity for two individuals who love each other. Nobody is forcing me to get married, like most women feel when they hear:'' you are getting old, don't you think it's about time to get married?'' Those women are forced and everyone thinks it's right because it's an accepted norm. My current girlfriend and I are happy together since 3 and a half years and she has no problem with me having other women.
Now tell me about the men who are married for 5-10 years and say that they're just with their wives because of the children, or because of the problems that arise after a divorce or because of fear from society (family pressure etc.) do they respect themselves and their wifes? Do they respect themselves when they stare secretly at other women, go to their wives, still think about them and they know that their wives know this, or worse if they watch rather porn for hours instead of being withh them?
Now when I say we should live in harmony with what nature has set for us I mean that we look after each others need how it should be, not how an authority dictates it.
Giving a women the protection she wants is living in harmony with nature.
The brainwashing is that a man and a women should have a relationship according to the accepted norm.
Most people don't question the things we are brought up with and that's the brainwashing.
So now tell me what is wrong with everything I said.
As a woman, and as an information geek I agree with what is being said to a point. Men were made to have other women. We age faster simply because after we have had our kids, we are biologically unimportant. It is a sad fact. As human beings who have evolved, and as women, who through use of our brains, makeup, and whatever else necessary we have the ability to attract men who choose beyond animal instinct. To choose to love only one person is a gift. Love devoted to one person is extremely rare. A man who isn't as stereotypically good looking, is more likely to be devoted to one if he has been rejected. We as women are less likely to be attracted to that man though. I know an extremely attractive man who has a girlfriend, and is very loyal. The idea of being with more than one woman is repulsive to him. He went several years without anyone, because he seeks a perfection that may or may not exist. He still notices beautiful women though. These men do exist. My father more than anything is in love with my mother out of intelligence. She wears no makeup, she has blazing white streaks of hair that most women would be too afraid to let show, and to top it off she refuses bras and pantyhose... My dad loves this about her. My dad is turned off by fakeness. I am not my mother, and live like most women. I dress up pretty, and actually enjoy it. Maybe a bit of rebellion that stuck? Point is, you can get something out of what this guy is saying.. Watch the discovery channel..read books, etc. Kissing was originally where the mother spit chewed up food into her childs' mouth. It has evolved over time into what it is today. Kissing isn't nutritionally nurturing anymore but is a type of nourishment. The world is changing, if women keep wanting and expecting a man who can remain loyal eventually it will happen. Men use to have a smaller member than they now do, because biology figured out that we like the bigger ones better. Learn about natural selection. The fact that the population of the world is getting out of hand may cause men to evolve to be loyal to one. Impregnating many women is not helpful. If men do not choose loyalty the consequence could be more women who are simply unable to have children being more common. That is happening now. Homosexuals may be an effort through evolution to control population. (I have nothing against homosexuals, in my mind they have either always been here or serve a purpose and are biologically needed in our modern world.) One of the best reasons that a man and woman benefit from a monogamous relationship is to prevent the spread of disease. Condoms help, but they can and do fail at times. If every man and woman adopted the open lifestyle STD rates would skyrocket! Think about it. If you have three girlfriends, and they all were with three other men and those men were with three other women..etc. etc. This is a gigantic onion of a subject, that is viewed in too much of a black and white way.
ReplyDeleteIf men were made to have other women, then women were made to have other men. It doesn't make any sense at all to say that all men were made to have sex with multiple women but not for women to do the same. Especially considering how there is 105:100 male to females born in the world. You would think it should be the other way around. More sexual variety for the females. Women desire sexual variety as well but they are more likely to be shunned for it, because of the sexist views on how men should be sexual creatures and women should not. It's all a bunch of bullshit, we are all human, we all desire sex- and new information comes out with females having higher sex drives than men, so explain that one.
DeleteIf men were made to have other women, then women were made to have other men. It doesn't make any sense at all to say that all men were made to have sex with multiple women but not for women to do the same. Especially considering how there is 105:100 male to females born in the world. You would think it should be the other way around. More sexual variety for the females. Women desire sexual variety as well but they are more likely to be shunned for it, because of the sexist views on how men should be sexual creatures and women should not. It's all a bunch of bullshit, we are all human, we all desire sex- and new information comes out with females having higher sex drives than men, so explain that one.
DeleteAnyone who finds this blog interesting should read "The Mating Mind" by Dr. Geoffrey Miller. It's a great book by a great professor, and I would encourage anyone to take an evolutionary psychology class.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that females get easily upset at the thought of an evolutionary explanation to the male drive for variety, yet men do not get as upset at an evolutionary explanation for a females' drive for hypergamy. Perhaps it's mistaking explanation with justification, when this is clearly not the case. Evolution can explain many behaviors that are not justified, and it does this because we are inherently selfish replicators giving us the propensity to commit culturally immoral acts.
It's not a "male" thing to desire variety. It's a human thing. It's time we clear up this stereotypical mess that makes it okay for men to be sexual and women to be shunned from it. Complete bullshit. Hypergamy-same thing. Some men seek women with status and material assets. Some women cheat on their partners. Let's break the boundaries and collect the truth from evidence instead of pouring more gender nonsense down everyones throats.
DeleteIt's not a "male" thing to desire variety. It's a human thing. It's time we clear up this stereotypical mess that makes it okay for men to be sexual and women to be shunned from it. Complete bullshit. Hypergamy-same thing. Some men seek women with status and material assets. Some women cheat on their partners. Let's break the boundaries and collect the truth from evidence instead of pouring more gender nonsense down everyones throats.
DeleteMen are able to have far more children than women, so mating behaviors are different. Testosterone is what drives this. F-M transgenders, and people who didn't have proper testosterone levels and were treated, report a massive spike in their sex drives.
Deletehttp://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/220/testosterone
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ReplyDeleteI'm a woman and I love my boyfriend but I fantazised with fucking my friends, his friends, my neighbors, my coworkers... specially during my ovulation days. He just needs mastubate and the itch will pass.
ReplyDeleteAnd what does this great girl receives in return? If the relationship is not balanced the girl will open her eyes even if sex is great and dump him in the most painful way. One of my friends is married, she does all of this for him and is the provider. He spends his time in front of the computer and is too macho for housekeeping. Marrying a woman is not enough as balance. She married him being a virgin and is a very loyal wife but she has lost respect for him and of course she is considering to cheat and dump him, she is so beautiful to turn all male's heads when she walks.
ReplyDeleteI wish there could be a post about how a lot of WOMEN are restless and getting the same sex from the same man for years can get pretty tiring too!
ReplyDeleteWe women are designed to bear babies from the fittest males (and "fit" can be anything--politically / financially / intellectually accomplished men). For a woman having children by several different fathers maximizes the chances that one of her children will become rich / powerful / successful / a credit to her and her family.
Four Blossoms I agree with you
ReplyDeleteFemale here. The part where he said that his girlfriend "even cleans Greg's room sometimes", set off a BIG red flag for me. Her boyfriend better watch out because I can guarantee him that his girlfriend either 1. Wants to secretly have sex with his roommate OR 2. Already has!!! It's so naive of guys to think that they are the only ones to crave variety. We women crave it, too. We just keep hush/hush about it. True words.
ReplyDeleteOMG I thought the same thing. She is cleaning Greg's room because she likes him and is "grooming him", or she is already with him on the side and cleans his room to set up an alibi if she ever gets caught in his room! She is being an amazing girlfriend because she's overcompensating!
DeleteI recently agreed to allow my bf of 7 years to have variety. I understand both sides of this and honestly our relationship has gotten so much better. We are happier, the sex is sooo much better and he's become this very caring and romantic man that I have always wanted. At first I wasn't for the whole "allowing him to cheat thing" but the more I thought about it and the more differences I've seen the more I am open to it. At first I thought it was because he didn't find me attractive after I had 2 kids and stopped paying attention to my looks and I felt he wanted something better and I wasn't enough but I realized it had nothing to do with our relationship. Hea a good man and I found a way to make both of our lives better.. I myself do not have a variety of sexual partners but I don't need it like I believe he does. Me and him are planning on getting married and I am just fine with giving him the "free pass" because that's how much I love him. Side not though he has not acted on this but I believe that just by letting him know he is allowed to be a man he has started to respect me a lot more and when and if he does act on it I will not be hurt. That's just my story I'm not saying it's for everyone but hey what works works.
ReplyDeleteAllowing a married man to occasionally have some variety is an act of kindness to him. Even if the female partner does not permit it or like it, it's still likely to occur in a deceitful way - surely the honest approach, as outlined by Anonymous Sept 2, is better. I'm a normal male and I'm lucky that there are legalised brothels where I live that enable me to have recreational sexual variety without emotional involvement. This has greatly enriched my life, brings a lot of joy, and has enabled me to stick with 35 years of marriage. I have a good sex life with my wife, but I also really enjoy these other satisfying sexual encounters with a range of women (different ethnicities and ages) and their wonderfully different bodies.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the point in trying to be the best wife? Nothing is ever enough. Wish I would have never married and put myself through the hurt of knowing my husband wants to screw around.
ReplyDeleteYall just need to be open with your women. Craving variety is understandable. Men get a testosterone boost with a new woman. Women are similar, we get a boost as well.
ReplyDeleteYou're guessing how she might feel and you never know. Women crave variety as well. Hell I know I do. I've been in a relationship for 3 years. I'm married. My man said he's perfectly fine being monogamous I said great lets have a threesome! Our marriage has no label. Sometimes it's open, sometimes it's closed.
I was cheated on in a past relationship. I wasn't even mad about the sex. It's the lying and manipulation. So if you're having an "itch"...you better believe she has one too.
What I can't stand is Some men only want the relationship to be open for them while their woman can't do anything. Why should we have to have the same dick for eternity? If men were more accepting of their women being with other men....
There would be a lot more open relationships.
Women are naturally intuitive and if she's doing all that she can sense something is wrong with you cuz When a guy has an issue with his woman he always becomes distant in a way. Women are hard wired to pick up on things like that since men don't like to communicate about their feelings.
You need to be honest with her before that thought turns into an action.
What I would also like to add from my previous comment. We are becoming ALOT closer. He's says he's never been with a woman who was okay with this. We have boundaries though. I actually brought an open relationship up. LOL
ReplyDeleteI disagree about men are made for multiple women but we aren't. Hell with a woman the sex session never ends until it's over for the guy. We can keep cumming. If we were only built for one man..why can we last for so long? Why are they knocked out after a couple of rounds sometimes while our cars are purring to hit the road again. That's a load of bullshit. If your with a guy and it's okay for him to fuck other people and you can't I say drop him. Leave that double standard crap alone. HUMANS CRAVE VARIETY! Stop leaving us women out.
I find this post really devastating but it's enlightening, I wish I was lesbian or asexual. As I'm alone now, this post gives me strength to continue, it doesn't worth, guys can't be loyal, they are just animals who don't give a shit on feelings, it just doesn't worth our time.
ReplyDeleteMen are not animals, as much as women are not billboard posters or a piece of meat. Both genders are multi-dimensional. A man's libido is like a hand on his shoulder beckoning him away from the long-sought-after security and stability he's acquired, a constant reminder of an unquenchable thirst. This cannot be eliminated but only acknowledged and then behaviour adjusted by the partner accordingly. It is not pleasant for the man to feel this. I have to say, sometimes I have to focus on the bad points of a stunning woman I see in the street just to endure walking past her. Lust is a natural but horribly frustrating and inconvenient force that would kill a man on knowing he doesn't or can't have her. The feeling of missing out is overwhelming. Women that exploit this knowing a man is taken are massively to blame.
DeleteI find it funny that most men are doing the looking and thinking about being with another, and for every guy like that, I hope his woman is at home being banged by the delivery man and so on. I knew a guy who was lust driven, breaking his neck to see a new pair of tits, and guess what? His wife left him, and I have no sympathy for him. Greg is probably doing your friend's girl, and more power to her.
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